New to the fors performance world please help!!

i never said i knew anything at all. the performance world i come from is full of computers and custom tuning and lots of patience. if i had the kind of money to build it all at once i can promise you i wouldnt be building a maverick as a race car. i came here for some simple suggestions not your sarcasm or smart comments so please if you dont have anything helpful to say just dont read it and go away. as far as doing things twice i can always sell a rebuilt motor for as much as i have into it and get another block. you need to understand although i would like to make this thing absolutly just a track car im not sure if i will i have 3 kids that start turning 16 in the next 5 years one right after the other so along with me building a car i also have to build 3 others for them to drive when they turn 16. and you know maybe i do make mistakes wouldnt be the 1st time and im sure it wouldnt be the last but i can promise you id only make it once.

 

hey welcome to the board, don't sweat everyone's comments. Everyone on this board has their own personality and it's all good. Between all the hazing and the wise cracks there is some good advice. Stay on the board and soon you'll know who to listen to for advice. there is some very smart people on this board who will give you info that'll save you a lot of money and headache. good luck

 

that was in responce to the orignal posters statement that he will start with the stock crank and rods. then later put the stroker in. i may have missunderstood but that was what i had understood his plan was.

 

We gave you simple suggestions and you just blew it all off. Sending a block to a machineshop without pistons and wanting them to just "bore it .030" is just plain wasteful and stupid. Yet, you insisted on doing it anyway. So it's obvious to me that you MUST know what you're doing. And good luck selling your mistakes to someone else and getting all your money back on it. The block I built my 331 around is just one such example. Cost me $100 from a local machineshop. I sold the new pi=stons and the rods to someone else for $100, so it cost me nothing for a hot-tanked block with new cam bearings Bargains like this aren't hard to find either. Guys like you are always making blunders when they ask for advice, but ignore the answers just because they think they know better when they hear an answer they don't like.

 

Thats why the guy on craigslist cant sell his .030 over block... interesting.

 

Now I'm curious ... I am not doubting that you need to have pistons in hand to make the CORRECT .030 bore, but WHY? What are the nuances of a .030 bore job? Is that the rings/pistons from one run or brand to another are not exactly .030?

And one comment ... there are a couple of posts in this thread that seem to be a little harsh and unnecesary!

 

In order to establish the proper piston to wall clearances the machinist must have the pistons on hand to measure them. He should index them to which bore they are going to be used in and take a measurement. Next, the bore will have to be measured to establish the correct amount of material removal. Different brands and/or different alloy pistons have different expansion rates. Therefore, you need to have the pistons on hand before ANY machine work takes place.

Elementary....really. Oh...was that too harsh?

 

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NOT HARSH

Good info ... makes sense to me. I was struggling with the situation when a block may be getting bored .030 over to overcome cylinder wall damage and once bored, it is determined that you need to go .040 over to get it right. Maybe this situation never comes up, or maybe it does and your just plain screwed on those rare instances.

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This part was not necessary

 

Dead on the money. And that wasn't too harsh.

 

Another question this all begs is, why do vendors even sell stock bore pistons? ... To get money out of us suckers? They are not going to match up to the stock bore right?

OR MAYBE ...
Bore matching is only mandatory for high HP/RPM engines in which the high stress loads call for tighter control of clearance tolerances ... MAYBE?
I am just trying to get the whole story out so folks don't think that if a .030 over block falls in your lap you should pass on it because it is total junk (i.e Justin's comment) unless this is an absolute fact for all situations. My intuition tells me it is not an absolute, but I do not know.

So please clarify, is bore matching a MUST and all 302 blocks prebored to .030 are pretty much junk for any application, or is bore matching simply a best practice that reduces risk of failure, and that this specific risk is increased as HP/RPM/compression/etc. is increased?

AND yes, it would seem that given the posters goals, bore matching is HIGHLY recommended, and not because I say so, but because you, the experts say so. And to make sure we are clear here, the experts comment is not meant to be sarcastic.

 

If you buy a block that is pre-cut it is never taken to the full measurement unless it is supplied with pistons. If you get a stock bore block then you can use stock bore pistons and do the finish honing to the piston size. The stock bore in a new block always needs to be finished to size.
Another reason for stock bore pistons is if you have a block sleeved to a standard bore size. This can save an original block in a numbers matching collector vehicle or provide a more wear resistant alloy in a performance engine. In this case the cylinder is completely bored out to the water jacket and fitted with a liner that seals at the top and bottom for both water sealing and combustion sealing. Properly done it can make an older block last a long time or a racing block into a great street block once again. The practice for sleeving a racing block for racing is a bit different as the liners are sometimes "oven brazed" into place to keep the block as rigid as possible.

 

Bore matching isn't a must, but if you want the engine to last as long as possible, then this is something that should be done. This minimizes the stresses to the rings, lands and skirts. And just as you want the minimum recommeded clearances between the walls and pistons, you also do not want the clearances too tight to where the piston wants to sieze up in the bore when it expands as it heats up to normal operating temps.

 

ok so the engine shop called and the engine is done so that is off my list. i just happened to stumble into an incredable deal for a second block that i will be picking up to make the stroker out of. now i got a question i aslo stumbled on to another really good deal its for an edelbrock victor jr intake and preformer carb 1405 for $200. my question is is the 600 cfm carb to much for now if i havent done heads or cam yet. also i found a z303 for $50 new is this a nice cam and how well would it work with the .030 bored 302 without good heads. i have decided i want to get it running since it will make it easier to get other things done to it if i dont have to trailer it but i dont want to buy things that will not work well with both engines. i will be building a secondary motor to be swapped next year sometime.

 

The Z's not going to work with stock heads and springs. Too much lift at the valve. That 600 Eddy's also not a good match for a Vic Jr. Really the Vic Jr's not a good choice for a mild 302. You'll find that it really doesn't turn on till around 3000 rpms. Both it and the Z cam will work better in a stroker with aftermarket heads.

 

not really looking for alot of power out of the rebuild just something better than stock till i get it painted and the stroker built. may go ahead and buy the cam for later i know it's not going anywhere anytime soon so i can wait till i deside definately what i wanna do cam wise. what im actually worried about is the carb being to large to get it running decent while i get the paint and interior stuff done.